Today is a continuation of last week’s question and answer episode, and I am so thankful for all the courageous couples who reached out with their questions. Here’s what we discuss in this episode:
- A husband wondering about using dildos and double penetration and getting some guidance there.
- A wife whose husband has been experiencing erectile dysfunction and navigating her own lack of satisfaction in bed.
- A husband reaching looking for some advice after he reacted poorly to discovering some erotic reading that his wife was doing and navigating the aftermath of what happened.
- A husband wondering if he is being selfish for wanting sex because his wife is showing a low level of interest, or none at all.
You can submit your anonymous questions on our website here.
And don’t forget to check out last week’s episode (#215) for more answers to your questions.
Resources:
December’s “Get it On-a-thon” Fundraiser: Get Frisky for Fertility!
You can find links to all these and more at our website: getyourmarriageon.com
Transcript
This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors or inaccuracies. For the most accurate and complete experience, we recommend listening to the full podcast episode
Episode 216
Dan: Everyone. Welcome back to get your marriage on. Today is a continuation of the last episode and where we did question and answer. And again, I have my lovely friend and coworker Caroline with [00:01:00] me,
Caroline: Hello.
Dan: And we are looking forward to diving into these great questions that you’ve asked us together.
Caroline: Yeah, we have some good ones today.
Okay, so this one’s from a husband’s perspective, and it’s about using dildos and double penetration and getting some guidance here. So just going to jump into it. He says, My wife and I like toys, and one night in bed, she suggested that she gets a dildo and pop it on the wall so we could engage in double penetration. We had never used a dildo, so I bought one. I wanted it to be a little realistic because I began enjoy the thought of my wife pleasuring herself with it while I watch, as well as engage in double penetration. It’s not a real person, and I just like the visual of it. Since we are both okay with this act, is it okay for us to continue to do as it doesn’t replace me or her?
Dan: Oh, I love this question. So my knee jerk, my, Initial answer is go for it. That sounds [00:02:00] exciting, right? A lot of us wrestle with that. Is it okay to blank, you know, and that’s a healthy question to ask yourself. And it’s good to ask yourself, is it okay if, you know, this could have been nothing about dildos or double penetration.
It could have been about any other sexual behavior they want to try. And I think it’s healthy that we ask ourselves, is it okay to, um, because it. Helps call into question our values, our past, our future, kind of all in one. And
this is how you forge a stronger psychological character. It’s part of our development.
because it invites us to think about our thoughts and beliefs, it gives you a chance to weed out the beliefs that no longer serve us or aren’t really based on truth and in its place plant new ideas and thoughts that actually serve us and help us live to our higher and deeper values in it.
So I’m glad he’s honestly addressing this question and his sexual desire in a constructive way because I think this [00:03:00] will lead to more maturity and personal growth for both of them.
Caroline: I completely agree and my first reaction to this question was well Is it blessing your marriage? Because if so then What’s the big deal kind of reaction because from my perspective sex was designed to build couples and their relationship and to bring them closer together and so my first thought was well, is this building your relationship and bringing you closer together?
And then the follow up questions I thought of well, are they both enjoying it? Do they both feel safe doing it? are they both, able to communicate about their desires and what they are and aren’t okay with? as long as I think those are at play and relevant and happening, then I don’t really see what could make it wrong to do for them.
Dan: Yeah, perhaps there’s some hesitation there because the dildo he bought looks realistic. And it’s kind of the idea of the thought of enjoying my wife, pleasuring yourself with another person’s [00:04:00] penis. That kind of an idea kind of calls into question certain values or might be a value clash in the mind.
And I, I can see where that might be coming from. But remember sex, And our sexual desires or sexual fantasies is a weird part of being human, right? Our, our best sexual erotic thoughts are things that, um, we would be embarrassed to announce in Sunday school. That’s just not right. That’s just the realm these things live in.
And as long as you can really make that a part of play, I think that’s a fantastic way to explore. So it’s okay that it’s a realistic dildo. If that’s what. The fantasy calls for because you’re engaging in a form of play with your spouse that will bring, you know, great deep meaning excitement. Some, uh, prohibitedness or whatever it is that really strokes those erotic human deep, Ah, Our [00:05:00] eroticism is so human, right? And it’s this humanness of it that makes sex so wonderful and beautiful and why we only want to share it with that one special person. So, definitely, I can see tremendous value if both people are excited and enthusiastic about this.
Caroline: I agree. Like you said, just go for it. Have fun and build that marriage. So. We have a wife, um, who brought up this next question and her husband has been experiencing erectile dysfunction. And so she comes to us with a question about navigating that and her lack of satisfaction due to that as well. So she says, I love my husband. We’ve been married 29 years, but I am not happy with our sex life. He has suffered with erectile dysfunction for years. Viagra doesn’t help. Nothing I do excites him. I have tried everything. Lingerie, [00:06:00] toys, dancing naked, giving him oral sex. Nothing. No reaction. I’m tired of feeling like a failure and undesirable. I’m not ugly or fat either. I don’t know how to get him to want me or to get hard enough for sex. Oral sex is good, but I want more, and he won’t use dildos on me. He says he feels inadequate and like it’s too impersonal. I’m exhausted and unhappy.
Dan: Yeah, I just want to acknowledge, that there’s a lot of pain that she’s having. And he must be in a lot of pain also about this situation. So when partners recognize, oh yeah, you’re in a lot of pain with this situation just as much as I am. I can only imagine, like speaking as a man in our society, men place high value on their sexual functioning, especially the function of and size and shape of their penis, uh, disproportionately.
So, right. As we’ve discussed, because. in our society, the functioning of their penis is a symbol of their [00:07:00] masculinity. And the reality is we don’t have a great sexual education, most of us, and we don’t realize that our penis’s functioning declines as we age. And even if we are taught this, somehow we believe we’re going to be an exception or we’re immune to that, and that declining in function as we age applies to everyone else but ourselves.
So when it stops functioning, people can freak out, right? A lot of men freak out about it. I’m glad that this person that wrote this question is realizing this has very little to do with her and as much to do with him and his struggle with his own self image around this.
It seems like he’d rather avoid sex or avoid anything arousing. Like he wants to shut it down in his mind before it even happens, because it’s a way for him to save himself from the embarrassment that as a member, isn’t going to do the job like it used to. So for him in his current frame of thinking, even using a dildo would be admitting he is now [00:08:00] obsolete.
And his ego just won’t let him let go to use the dildo. but of course he’s not the one that wrote the question, right? We got to help the woman out, the woman that wrote the question. So I’d say to her, recognize his sense of loss and accepting his struggle will kind of help you unhook from his performance problems.
We often get. Emotionally and meshed in our marriages when we’re psychologically depend on our spouse to be a certain way so that we can be a certain way. We try to control outcomes like for her. I’ve tried dancing. I’ve tried lingerie. I’ve tried all these things. Viagra. Nothing is helping him. How can I solve his problem?
and she might be thinking, if only he’d not feel bad about his ED and just love me the way I want, we’d be so much happier. Can’t you just see how simple it would be if you just take one or two little steps in this direction? It’s easy to think that way. It’s a common way to think, but that line of thinking often evades personal responsibility in it.
Coaching, I think, can be really helpful in this [00:09:00] area for this couple because it’ll help you recognize areas where you both tend to try to control each other, like she trying to control her husband, husband trying to control her instead of trying to control themselves. For instance, as a woman, if you were the more assertive personality type, just deciding to use a dildo on yourself when you’re together might be a step forward to help break the spell in your marriage.
Or learn how to just drop the rope and not make sex and make his sexual performance always a power struggle. And if you can actually unhook from that, you might actually enjoy being intimate together. It might even mean accepting a loss short term that you may not be able to enjoy in recourse the way you would, but it opens you up to enjoying each other’s emotional and the meaning developing sections of sexual intimacy that you may have been closed off to because you’re too narrowly focused on a particular way of doing things.
Caroline: Yeah, and, oh man, there’s so much, but I think taking a [00:10:00] moment to pause and step back and realize she can’t control him or his erectile dysfunction. It’s not her fault. She can’t just fix it. And I don’t know if this is a terrible analogy, but this is the one I came up with, um, in my head was if her husband left to go to work and he came home with a broken arm, would she go, Oh my gosh, that broken arm is my fault.
I’ve got to fix it. And no matter what she does, she can’t fix that broken arm. only time in a cast is going to fix that broken arm. And in a similar sense, like, it’s not her fault for the erectile dysfunction, like you said, there’s a lot going on at play, and so no wonder she’s exhausted if she’s taking on the full responsibility of This Evie that would be exhausting to me. So I think just taking a moment to step back analyzing those thoughts and beliefs and realizing she can’t control it and it’s not necessarily her fault, which is how it sounds like [00:11:00] she’s framing it and coaching.
I think could really help to analyze and pull back and understand maybe what thoughts and beliefs are going on here.
Dan: That’s great. the very first lesson in the module in the get your marriage on program is about learning how to take full responsibility for everything on your side of your marriage. And when we focus so much on our spouse’s inadequacies and their failings, and in this case, they’re even their dysfunction, that hyper focus on someone else.
precludes us from taking full responsibility for our side of things, and it gets us wrapped up in a cycle that’s unhealthy in our marriages. And this, this can apply to lots of other things too, not just erectile dysfunction. So one thing that will help, uh, you if you’re in this situation is to take a step back and ask yourself, where am I not taking full responsibility in this?
Or am I taking too much responsibility for something that I don’t have control over? Either way is not a helpful outcome for a marriage. By [00:12:00] the way, there’s no guarantee that this will happen, but individuals in their marriages who start taking full responsibility for their side of the marriage, you usually end up like dropping the rope, so to speak.
stop making everything a power struggle, and they learn how to come to more peace with things, it puts pressure on the other spouse then to also step up and take full responsibility for themselves. In other words, if she were to take full responsibility for her sexual, uh, functioning in this marriage, there’s a really good chance that her husband will step up on his own accord and start to really address his erectile dysfunction.
Caroline: Yeah, as you’re both stepping into a place of owning what you’re going through and problem solving. There’s other solutions out there that you might not see yet.
Okay, Dan, I have another one. So this is husband reaching out asking for some advice after he reacted poorly to discovering some erotic reading that his wife [00:13:00] was doing. So he’s turning to us for some help and some guidance on navigating the aftermath of what happened.
So, he says. Dan, I wish I started listening to your podcast before I made a huge mistake. I found years worth of books on my wife’s Kindle with very graphic, explicit novels involving group sex. I kind of flipped out and became very insecure. That’s when I found you. We still have sex, and it’s been great thanks to some of your counsel. But when I confronted her, she felt that I shamed her, and she’s right. understand that fantasies are just fantasies. Now I do. Since I confronted her, she’s closed off to talking about sex. I’m sure she’s afraid of getting shamed and guilted again, or afraid of my reaction to what she might tell me. want to repair the damage I caused and be open with her, and her with me. I want to be free to talk about what we want, including all the dirty fantasies. [00:14:00] How can I initiate this, or at least get the ball rolling in the right direction.
Dan: Alright, so
what I’d say to this man is she’s not safe opening up about her fantasies. Now, since her interaction with her in which she felt shamed, frankly, she probably didn’t feel safe before either. That’s probably why she wanted to keep it hidden from you. Like she didn’t want you to find out about her graphic novels on her.
Kindle, probably. Um, and she didn’t want you seeing them. So, there’s that component. There wasn’t safety before and there’s definitely not safety after. And for some people, they don’t want to share their sexual fantasies with their spouse, right? They’re afraid that if they share them, they’ll be judged or evaluated for them.
So it’s safer to keep our fantasies to ourselves and not share them with our spouse. It could also be that they feel insecure about their own fantasies, regardless of how trusting and shame free you could be. In other words, it could be nothing to do with you, and she may still [00:15:00] not want to share her fantasies, just because fantasies by nature, some of them, just make us feel really insecure.
I remember I did an exercise must be four years ago where I set a timer for 10 minutes and I just wrote free writing without filter and what my sexuality wanted and a lot of my fantasies came out in that and I was a little shocked with what was what was coming out right with I don’t give myself a filter.
What do I want to do sexually? When I was finished, um, I had a decision to make. Do I share this with my wife, or do I burn the paper? And I’ve been there. It’s really hard to share this, this deep part of ours, because some of it feels a little dark. Some of it feels a little, um, we just don’t know how it’ll be accepted.
So oftentimes, There’s just insecurity around sharing fantasies. Now, demanding that your spouse shares her fantasies with you, uh, demanding that like if my wife were to demand that she [00:16:00] reads my paper, that won’t put us in a good position. I have to want to be willing to share, or at least part of it with her in that situation.
So, um, you gotta, you gotta take this delicately and with a great deal of respect and I think pushing the issue will, will drive things further. So that’s one piece of this that I see. There’s more, but I want to hear your thoughts, Caroline.
Caroline: Yeah, well, I agree. The more you push something, the more that it could actually push it away
Dan: Mm hmm. Mm
Caroline: to it.
Dan: hmm.
Caroline: and I like that. He’s taking accountability for what happened in the situation. He recognizes that the way he responded. wasn’t how he’d respond now, the information he has, and I think giving himself grace, realizing he’s a different person now than he was then, That although he’s a different person now, his wife needs to maybe hear that, clearly from him. So when he’s trying to get the ball rolling on a conversation or [00:17:00] connect with his wife, I think he might need to hear him say, Hey, I know when I learned about those books the first time I reacted really poorly and I shamed you for them.
And I am so sorry that happened. I would go back in time and change it if I could, but I can’t. I have a completely different perspective now. I’d love to talk with you about it come from that approach , to his wife,
Dan: It’s about the relationship repair, right? Really working on the repair. Yeah.
Caroline: working on repairing, because you can’t go back in time,
Dan: Mm hmm.
Caroline: you can move forward, and you can work on that repair, and although you’ve already taken accountability, it might be good for her to hear it again, start building that trust.
Like you said, it sounds like there needs to be some trust there, she needs to feel safe there. And he could even say, hey, look, I’d love to work towards being able to talk more openly about sex and about these things. Um, what do you feel like you need in order to get to that point of feeling comfortable and how can I help? Like that could be really beneficial. [00:18:00] That’s why, that’s why I love coaching. Cause it helps couples learn to communicate tough situations like all the ones we’ve talked about today.
Dan: Yeah, one last thing I would say to this is this is a really good opportunity to examine other aspects of your relationship that might need a deeper look. This definitely, this experience finding these things on our Kindle has exposed something that you may not have recognized in your relationship.
So in other words, this, trial you’re going through is a gift if you look at it that way in exposing other areas or shining a light in other areas in your relationship that need attention. For example, are there your relationship where you take a judgmental or critical stance at your wife’s preferences?
when they’re different from you? Or even, even non sexual preferences, right? Or is there a space where you can work on appreciating your differences as a couple and focus on cherishing her for her unique individuality rather than wishing she’d conform to be more like how you want her to [00:19:00] be?
Caroline: Okay This one is from a husband’s perspective Who’s wondering if he is being selfish for wanting sex because his wife is showing a low level of interest Or none at all. So, his question is, My wife and I just had our first baby a couple of weeks ago. Before the baby’s birth, we hadn’t had sex for close to two or three months. can say it’s probably been about four or five months without sex. fully understand the need not to have sex soon after childbirth. But even before my wife got pregnant, she didn’t really show interest to have sex sometimes. Sometimes I had to even ask for sex. it normal for women and wives not to be interested in sex? Sometimes I am afraid to bring the sex issue up because it may seem as if I do not consider her needs. Am I selfish?
Dan: this is an excellent question, and I think it’s, So many people have the same situation, you know, [00:20:00] whether a baby is coming or not, where, just over time, one person’s desire in sex just really goes down while the other person stays constant or even increases, right? So this desire discrepancy is, uh, The biggest issue a lot of couples run into in their marriages.
And this is what I really address head on in my program. Now, I wouldn’t say it’s normal or abnormal for your wife to not be interested in sex as he asked, right? It’s like, is this normal that she’s not interested in sex? I, I reframed this a bit. we use those terms, but I want you to think about it a little differently.
We never just have sex. Humans don’t just have sex. We always participate in a meaning. It’s impossible to separate meaning from sex. So a better question to ask is if you can get inside your wife’s head, what meanings are at play when we do engage sexually? And are those meanings that are pleasant for her?
Are those meanings that are exciting to her? For example, if the meaning in her head is. If I don’t have sex with [00:21:00] my husband, he’s going to stray. Or this is what just what good wives do. They need to give their husband sex. Or if I have sex with him, then he won’t be pouty or angry. Do you see how those are all meanings that are not about her own pleasure?
They’re not about her own replenishment. They’re all about in service of someone else. That’s not a meaning we like to participating. It’s not a fun meaning. So, Sometimes though, it’s good judgment to be low desire in marriage. If I have a, if I’m married to someone and they, are pouty around sex, they feel entitled to sex, it would actually be good judgment for me to not be interested in sex because those aren’t meanings that are favorable or enjoyable to participate in.
So, we can’t just blanket say. You know, she should have more desire, because the meanings that are in operation have a great deal to do with desire levels. [00:22:00] I also want to say it’s not the baby. Um, well, to an extent your, your wife just gave birth. That’s pretty incredible. And her body will need time to heal.
And if you’re breastfeeding or not sleeping well, there’s going to be a lot of times sex is the last thing on your mind and that’s perfectly fine. But that being said. There are many women who actually really like sex, and they kind of miss not having sex during the postpartum, postpartum recovery period.
And they look forward to the time they can get back to it, because for them, they find sex so replenishing. It’s a time they feel really loved on, and, and uh, doted on, and uh, for, for once, to be served instead of them serving someone else. So, It’s not the baby, but maybe the problems persisted and because of the baby, it’s exacerbated.
It’s highlighted the problem that has already been going on. It just magnified it more. So it’s a gift. That you can now see the dynamic that may have been more [00:23:00] hidden before.
Caroline: Can I just touch on You said like many women Like sex and look forward to getting back to it And I just I just want to caution this husband here to not compare his wife to those women in this instance yes, some women really do love getting back to sex and really desire and Um, I love that you shared that to show that there’s no normal when it comes to sex and postpartum and all of those things Um, what’s normal for you is normal for you.
It doesn’t really translate to any other couple or person so I just wanted to To add in, to be cautious not to compare her to those who have that higher desire and then apply external pressure because she doesn’t have the desire that you think she should have because other women do. If that makes sense. Does that make sense, Dan?
Dan: Makes sense.
Caroline: come out okay?
Dan: Be careful of comparison.
Caroline: Yes.
Dan: Now, I don’t think it’s selfish. to advocate for something that’s better for your marriage. So in the back of this husband’s mind is like, I [00:24:00] want it, but I know she doesn’t want it. So if I ask for sex, if I bring it up, does that mean I’m not being considerate of her needs? And it might, maybe, maybe it’s not being considerate and you should check yourself on that, but maybe it is being considerate
because of the gifts that sex can bring to a marriage union, as long as the meanings at play are positive meanings. So, you’ve got to really examine the meanings, the scripts, the, the ideas and thoughts and beliefs that she has around sex, and the ones that you have, and how they overlap or collide in this situation.
Caroline: Yeah, I, I like what you said that, it’s not selfish to advocate for something, that’s going to help better your marriage.
Desiring sex with your spouse is natural, however, it’s possible that the way that you come across could show that you aren’t considering her needs and what she’s going through. So, Being able to step back and be like, okay, do I want sex for the right [00:25:00] reasons? Is it a goal of wanting to connect with his spouse? With his wife? Because He loves her or is it he just really wants to have an orgasm right now And the way to do that is to have sex with his wife because those two meanings behind sex and the purpose that they serve One is going to create more connection and desire for both spouses than the other one so I guess just giving both of yourself grace, because you welcomed a new child in, and that’s a lot of adjusting for both of you, and just the last thing I want to share is there’s so many ways to connect sexually that don’t require intercourse. so maybe just find out ways that you can connect that, while you’re working on building desire and meaning of finding ways to kiss or touch or be connected to each other that don’t put the pressure on your wife to just move straight to intercourse because there’s so many fun ways to connect that aren’t just goal oriented intercourse and orgasm.
Dan: Caroline, I love that. We say that a lot, that there’s [00:26:00] more than one way to connect sexually than just intercourse. But we never say what those other things are.
Caroline: Yeah,
Dan: are some of your favorite ways? That’s a very personal question. What are examples of, of other people’s favorite ways to connect sexually, that don’t involve intercourse?
Caroline: yeah, there’s different ways that you can connect physically through touch. Whether that’s kissing, making out, kissing each other’s bodies and different parts of each other’s bodies. Intimate massages. Non sexual massages. There’s so many ways that I’ve heard people love to connect. Showering together. each other down with body wash and a loofah. Like, There’s so many. Oral sex, actually, even.
I don’t know how I missed that one. I know people love that one. So, those are just the ones that come off the top of my head. What about you, Dan? What are some ways you’ve heard people love to connect?
Dan: I’ll speak for myself, but one of the great turning points in my own sexual relationship [00:27:00] with my wife was when we, learned how to enjoy arousal for arousal’s sake. That arousal didn’t mean it had to finish or lead to orgasm. So,
Caroline: I love
Dan: we can be highly aroused and stay highly aroused without it turning into One or both people must end in an orgasm.
So
Caroline: love
Dan: it’s about learning how to relax into the arousal, learning to enjoy the arousal and not be overcome by the arousal. So do arousing things, very arousing things. that’s really connecting. this might be TMI, but this is my podcast. So here it goes. when we first learned this principle, we went on a getaway, just the two of us.
and to have no kids and weekend to ourselves. We’re just so excited. And, uh, we had this idea that we’re going to have a lot of sex that weekend, but I wasn’t allowed to ejaculate. [00:28:00] That was our rule. So, and we did, we got to our destination. First thing we did is dropped our pants and we went for it, but we stopped just shy of me ejaculating.
Now she could have as many orgasms as she wanted, but what this did is it forced us to really focus on the arousal of our weekend and not so much these peaks and valleys that orgasm gives. And we made love so many times that weekend. in fact, it felt like just one long weekend of love making instead of like distinct starts and stops kind of all bled into one, even though we’re doing lots of other fun activities to outdoors and, and, hiking, cycling, Things like that too that we really enjoy, but there’s just this pervasive feeling of we can enjoy arousal and be in a highly aroused state and stay there instead of it having to mean something’s wrong if we don’t like take this over into orgasm.
[00:29:00] So that’s one way we have found to connect sexually.
Caroline: I love that. that sounds like a fun trip you guys went on.
Dan: I am grateful for these courageous questions from these couples. If you have a question, you can go to getyourmarriageon. com, click on resources and anonymous question. That comes to me and we will do our very best to address those in upcoming podcast episodes. email newsletters on our Instagram or Facebook groups, wherever you can find us.
I want to remind you that we have this great Get It On a Thon coming up. Check out the Intimately Us app for that. And if you would like more hands on help in your own marriage, overcoming challenges that you might have, or even if it’s just about making something good and just taking it to the next level, making a good thing great, Please check out the get your marriage on program.
It really is built for couples who are listeners to this podcast. You’ll find a lot of value and benefit [00:30:00] to the expert guidance and direction that this coaching, this container, this process can give you.
